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World Affairs Summer 2008

Andrew Bacevich

Andrew Bacevich: Anti-Imperialist

Andrew Bacevich on international relations and foreign policy.
Title: Lessons of Vietnam Revisited
Keywords:

A friend writes:

I'm just back from Vietnam and Cambodia, after two weeks in Thailand. I imagine you would not recognize much anymore—but perhaps I am wrong about that. The famous hotels of Saigon that you may have known have all been redone, plus myriad new ones have sprung up. In a sense this "Communist" state is more capitalist than George W. Bush's fondest dreams. People who were in Hanoi five years ago told us it had been a bicycle city then; now it is motor scooters—millions of them. And they are being added at the rate of thousands a month, even in a few days. That is the basic signature item of Vietnam's youth culture—scooters and cell phones.

Government bigwigs are in on the bonanza of land values, because they know where investment will go next. Outside Hanoi—which remains an ugly stepsister to Saigon—huge factories have sprung up employing thousands of Vietnamese, who do not have labor unions to protect them, or unemployment compensation or good health plans supplied by the employer. And, we are told, the population which is 65 percent under 30, have little interest in politics. A major source of income for Vietnam comes from foreign remissions of the overseas Vietnamese—family members of the boat people. These funds will dry up, but tourism has become a major factor with more than 5 million Americans visiting last year. In addition, the U.S. invested (we are told) $10 billion last year.

A classic scene of the way Vietnam has gone would be China Beach and the Danang area—on the ocean side of the main road are (quite literally) miles of luxury hotels. Cemeteries have been moved, with a small compensation to families, who then can't buy new houses because values have gone up. On the other side of the road, the ruins of the old airbase. And this is true of several of the cities we visited, Nha Trang, Dalat, etc. We had dinner at a luxury hotel on the beach at Nha Trang near Cam Ranh Bay—and it was out on the beach that could have been Hawaii. One entrepreneur purchased an island near Nha Trang for less than $100,000. Now his hotel and spa and the island are worth $7 million. People sunbathe while Vietnamese wait on them with cold drinks, and facial massages. Above you, near the beach, people soar off in hang gliders.

We had dinner in one of the newest luxury restaurants in Saigon….  I asked [the owner] if it was difficult to get permission to build and open up. Looking around he said, no, and indicated by gestures that it was money under the table. I did not see a single Vietnamese eating in the restaurant, but the waiters seemed very happy. The key to becoming something or somebody in Vietnam is to be found in learning English. That is crucial. You can't fight your way up to the top without English.

Fifty years ago the operative assumption in Washington was that the Vietnamese people were incapable of managing their own affairs. To allow them to do so would yield dire consequences. Were the United States to step aside, the results would be twofold. First, in Southeast Asia, totalitarianism would surely triumph, with millions enslaved as a result. Second, according to the domino theory, that triumph would surely embolden America’s adversaries in the global Cold War, thereby endangering the security of the United States itself.

Faced with this prospect, Americans had no choice but to draw a line in the rice paddies and make a stand. So insisted several successive administrations and any number of pundits.

The woeful results of that insistence remain painful to contemplate even now.

Today, of course, presidents and pundits insist with equal assurance that various and sundry populations in the Islamic world—Afghans currently occupy the spotlight—are incapable of managing their own affairs. Further, were the United States to allow Afghans, Iraqis, Iranians, Pakistanis—the list goes on—to self-determine themselves, we would surely open up ourselves to attack, at least on the scale of 9/11 if not far worse. 

So the United States finds itself engaged in a war that has gone on longer than the Vietnam War, with no end in sight. Much like their predecessors back in the 1960s, the Wise Men (and women) of present-day Washington are unable to conceive of an alternative to open-ended conflict on the other side of the world. 

Although the discomfort that many Americans feel in recalling Vietnam is all too understandable, our present circumstances demand that we make the effort. 

When the Vietnam debacle finally ended, discerning its “lessons” became for a time a cottage industry. Yet only now, decades later, are the war’s real lessons becoming evident. Two lessons in particular cry out for our attention.

First, peering across a vast cultural and historical divide to discern what it is that others “want” (or “need”) is exceedingly difficult. To imagine that American power, wealth, and know-how offer a neat recipe for reducing those difficulties is surely a delusion. American tutoring serves primarily to squander lives and money while annoying, if not altogether alienating, the subjects of our ostensible beneficence.

Second, allowing others to exercise real self-determination just might serve U. S. interests better than insisting that things be done our way. In Da Nang and Cam Ranh Bay, the Americans came and went, leaving behind a few ruins. Vietnam remains stubbornly Vietnamese. And yet when offered the chance, the Vietnamese take from us what they find useful for their own purposes. They choose, rather than having choice shoved down their throats. As a result, the Vietnamese people today have gained for themselves what American nation-builders once aspired to create: a dynamic, increasingly prosperous society that poses little threat to any of its neighbors and none to the United States.  

Is the result a Jeffersonian democracy? Maybe not. Yet the outcome—which the U. S. war and all that it involved merely served to retard—works for the Vietnamese and works for us as well. 

The Vietnam War was unnecessary and counterproductive. Is it not at least possible that the same might be said of the Long War as well?

mindy bricker


Comments:
Neil Kitson
March 13, 2010 12:15:14 AM
Yes.
John Seiler
March 13, 2010 04:00:26 AM
Another thing Vietnam now has is religious liberty. After sever persecution following the fall of Saigon in 1975, today Catholics and other Christians enjoy religious freedom. A Vietnamese priest I know, one of the "boat people" of the late 1970s, recently went to the Catholic seminary in Hanoi and said it was overflowing with novices.
Oble
March 13, 2010 06:24:33 AM
It should be noted that Americans have a culture that is closer to the Vietnamese than the Middle East. From Osama to Chalabi to Karzi this inability to understand the situation is being exploited ruthlessly.
Vic Anderson
March 13, 2010 09:04:26 AM
Obamirrorspeak: Corporate BushCo.-dependendence at home; Bush Wars, abroad!
AVietnamWarVeteran
March 13, 2010 09:49:35 AM
The real 'lesson' of the Vietnam War is our refusal to learn any lessons from that war. The Vietnamese people have moved on - America is still stuck in a Vietnam War mentality. There were lessons to be learned from our own Revolutionary War - but - we refuse to learn any lessons!
jackb
March 13, 2010 11:05:37 AM
So, Uncle Ho and General Giap were capitalists at heart, they were just sidetracked by Uncle Joe & Chairman Mao. Too bad we didn't realize that fifty years ago. I wonder if that line in the rice paddy is still there, like our own Mason Dixon Line. What are we fighting for? I don't give a damn, next stop is Teheran. Because, no one really wants to go to Pyongyang. Wen Jiabao might close the loan window.
Tim
March 13, 2010 11:13:27 AM
There is no doubt if the United States government abandoned its interventionist, imperialist foreign policy, trade and commerce would yield a more peaceful and prosperous world but what that wouldn't be good for the military industrial complex. Nor would such a world be good for our mandarin politcal class who enjoy strutting around the globe hectoring and lecturing the world about American Exceptionalism.
Peter RV
March 13, 2010 07:32:58 PM
Situations in Vietnam and today have an essential difference. The war in Vietnam was explained as a war against communist expansion, so it had a cause, however it might look stupid today. Our present wars in the ME, have no justification except as wars to install Israel as a regional power. This nobody will admit. So, we shall be fighting wars until Israel becomes satisfied.
Zhu Bajie
March 13, 2010 10:00:42 PM
"Our present wars in the ME, have no justification except as wars to install Israel as a regional power." Speed up the Rapture, the Second Coming! You need to listen to my Fundamentalist radio.
Alan MacDonald
March 13, 2010 10:52:36 PM
The difference is between what I call "Empire-thinking" and "democracy-thinking" --- that's all. Alan MacDonald Sanford, Maine
History Punk
March 14, 2010 12:29:46 AM
" of managing their own affairs. To allow them to do so would yield dire consequences. Were the United States to step aside, the results would be twofold. First, in Southeast Asia, totalitarianism would surely triumph, with millions enslaved as a result. Second, according to the domino theory, that triumph would surely embolden America’s adversaries in the global Cold War" Millions of people were enslaved. They still live in a dictatorial hellhole, just a garden variety tryanny rather than one with a coherent ideology. Also, Laos and Cambodia fell into the Communist camp as well. The domino theory happened, the results weren't as bad as we predicted.
John C
March 14, 2010 11:46:49 AM
How come we always choose to fight totalitarianism and en- slavement against weak, third world countries (Vietnam, Korea, Afghanistan, Iraq, Colombia, Iran, etc.,etc.? Who gave the US the mandate to police the nations of the world? Typical neocon rhetoric to promote sending our precious youth and our treasure to all corners of the world and then railing against raising taxes to pay for such escapades or sending their children to fight. Tax cuts do not balance the budget nor do they fund the military-industrial complex of which they are ever so fond. But at least it provides profits for the capitalists. Sick!
Anthony
March 14, 2010 02:46:06 PM
The Christian Montagnard hill tribes of Vietnam are severely persecuted. I was just in this region as a journalist and interviewed missionaries first-hand about this sad fact. The Communist military controls 13 Special Economic Zones. Such things should be addressed in this otherwise excellent article
Michael E Piston
March 14, 2010 04:16:03 PM
It is easy to dismiss the "domino theory" in retrospect, after the U.S. long and stubborn resistance in South Vietnam demonstrated the high price Communists would have to pay to triumph elsewhere in the region, and after President Nixon managed to successfully achieved detente with both the Chinese and the Soviet Union, causing them both to lose interest in confronting U.S. interests around the world. We will never know what the results would have been of a quick Communist victory in the 1960s would have been. However, if Afghanistan is any guide, it probably would have resulted in a renewed boost of confidence among Communists around the world possibly have reinvigorated both the Soviet and Chinese commitment to world revolution, much as the expulsion of the Soviets from Afghanistan convinced OBL that he could defeat the United States as well. Also, while it is indeed fortunate that the Vietnamese Communists ultimately morphed into a corrupt autocracy not much different from the regime it replaced in the South, it was at least equally possible that Vietnam today could be a vast prison or even death camp a' la North Korea or Pol Pot's Cambodia. Indeed, were it not for Deng Xiaoping's revolution in China, Vietnam may well have become a quite different country than it is now. The U.S. had ever reason to believe in 1965 that the War in Vietnam was a struggle to protect the people of Southeast Asian from an Orwellian nightmare along the line's of Mao's China or Stalin's Russia.
Tim R
March 14, 2010 06:33:10 PM
"The U.S. had ever reason to believe in 1965 that the War in Vietnam was a struggle to protect the people of Southeast Asian ..." Where in the US Constitution is there a requirement for the United States to go around the world to "protect the people" of any country but our own? So what if South Vietnam fell to the commies? Were they going to use it as a stepping stone to launch an attack on Washington? Anti-Communist hysteria egged on by the military industrial complex and its cheerleaders had disastrous consequences then. The phony, neocon "Islamofascism" line produces the same result today. Weighed in the balance, the American people and their leaders have a perennial inability to learn history's lessons.
Sam, Washington, DC.
March 16, 2010 03:52:28 PM
It is now abundantly clear to me that our United States Government has been run in the past by demented bunch of racist colonial thugs, the manipulating treacherous oligarchs. Sadly, it is still run by the same kind of maniacs. That is why we ran genocidal wars in Vietnam in 1960s. And, we still continue to do so in Iraq and Afghanistan. God, When will all this madness end. It is anybody's guess !!!

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